Conspiracy Nation -- Vol. 12 Num. 06
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("Quid coniuratio est?")
[Editor's note: Circa Autumn 1995, Sherman Skolnick's guest on his popular Chicago public access television program, "Broadsides," was independent film producer Cibacuyo Aguay Banar(sp?), a.k.a. "Ciba." Ciba has been investigating the attempted assassination in May of 1972 of then-Governor George Wallace. What follows is an abbreviated transcription of Skolnick's and Ciba's remarks.]
SKOLNICK: Tell our viewers what you've been working on.
CIBA: For the past three years I've been involved in a film that I'm producing, dealing specifically with the conspiracy and attempted assassination of Governor George Wallace of Alabama on May 15th, 1972.
SKOLNICK: You've travelled thousands of miles. What kinds of interviews have you done?
But first of all, tell us: Has there been any real documentary made of what some feel was a conspiracy to assassinate George Wallace?
CIBA: Not only has no documentary been made; no book has ever been written dealing with the attack on Wallace. My book is going to be, hopefully, the first.
SKOLNICK: Why have the assassination researchers ignored the Wallace attempted assassination?
CIBA: I believe that the answer to that question lies in the fact that the assassination of President Kennedy was one of the most seminal acts in the history of mankind, and thus, there is a concentration on wanting to solve the quandry, the mystery, the enigma, tied into that particular assassination.
SKOLNICK: What kind of interviews have you done in pursuit of this documentary, which you're hoping to get on television and then into a book?
CIBA: We interviewed Governor Wallace at his residence in Alabama.
SKOLNICK: You wanted him on videotape, but he was too ill.
CIBA: Yes. He was too ill to allow us to bring in our cameras. We had to write out a questionaire and submit it to the Governor, and then he went, question by question, answering each one as I stood at his bedside. We were, however, allowed the privilege of being able to photograph him.
He's bed-ridden, and disease has taken its toll on his voice-box. He is barely able to make himself audible, so that most of the questions (though not all of them) he will answer "yes" or "no."
SKOLNICK: At the time Wallace was shot -- so to speak into a wheelchair and not into the cemetery -- he was running for President and pulling about 21 percent of the vote.
CIBA: Which comes to 26 million popular votes.
SKOLNICK: But because of the different states that it was into, he could have had the whole thing thrown into the House of Representatives, where it would have been a turmoil.
Recently we did a show with spokespersons for some third-party candidates, including those for Perot. And I raised the same question. (Perot had 19 percent in the '92 election.) And when I raised this question, they said, "Oh, so if Perot had 21 percent, like Wallace, they'd have to shoot him?" I said, "In my opinion, yes." Why is that? I mean, some of us believe that the ultra-rich believe in the bullet, not the ballot. Is that the bottom line?
CIBA: The bottom line is money, the almighty dollar: who can best serve the interests of the Northeastern Atlantic elite and the Southwestern Pacific elite.
SKOLNICK: Just prior to Wallace being shot, he had made a statement. He said, "There's not a dimes worth of difference between the Democrat and Republican Parties." (He was a third-party candidate, very populist.) He said, "If I'm elected, one of the first things I'm going to do is tax the Rockefeller Foundation." When I heard that, I said, "Wallace, you haven't got enough life insurance." So you weren't able to get Wallace on video, but you still got pictures.
"AND WITH THE STUB OF HIS CIGAR, WALLACE POKED AT THE
NAME OF RICHARD NIXON. HE SAID, 'CONSPIRACY! CONSPIRACY!'"
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CIBA: One of the questions that I asked the Governor in writing was, "Was there a conspiracy behind the shooting of your person?" He said, "Yes. Definitely a conspiracy." And then he looked up, on the page, to where a previous question had been asked regarding Richard Nixon. And with the stub of his cigar he poked at the name of Richard Nixon. He said, "Conspiracy! Conspiracy!" And he jabbed at the name of Nixon on the page.
SKOLNICK: What else leads you to believe that there was a conspiracy?
CIBA: There was no way that Richard Nixon was ever going to be re-elected with Wallace in the campaign. To get back into the Oval Office, you had to do away with Wallace so that most of those 26 million votes -- which were center, or right of center -- would come over to the side of Nixon.
SKOLNICK: What do you make of the fact that 6 weeks after they took Wallace out of the campaign by almost killing him, the Watergate break-in occurred?
CIBA: The Watergate break-in was nothing more than a contrivance: a poorly executed mission that had, at its very bottom, a very sharp hatchet. And the hatchet was aimed at Nixon's head. The Watergate break-in was designed to be found, and to point the blame at Nixon and bring him down.
SKOLNICK: E. Howard Hunt, Frank Sturgis, and others, were involved in the break-in at the Watergate. And there's reason to believe that the White House sent E. Howard Hunt to Arthur Bremer's [Bremer found guilty of shooting Wallace] apartment in Milwaukee...
CIBA: ...on orders from Charles Colson.
SKOLNICK: Bremer's apartment, after the shooting of Wallace, was not sealed off; stuff could have been planted there, such as fake diaries. In other words, Arthur Bremer's diary showed up.
CIBA: Yes, but the diary showed up in the car.
But when Bremer shot Wallace, the first people that went physically into the apartment were from a bogus news organization known as "TIPS" -- Transcontinental International Press Services. Now they are a creature of the Guardians, which are the militant wing of the Church of Scientology. And I'm talking about the branch in Los Angeles.
SKOLNICK: The Secret Service allowed Bremer to penetrate Nixon's security. In other words, if you create a vacuum where a would-be assassin can penetrate Secret Service security, then it becomes easy to kill somebody. Like they did with Dr. King: withdraw the security.
CIBA: Bremer was in the city of Ottawa, Capital of Canada, when Nixon was visiting Pierre Trudeau, the Canadian Prime Minister at the time. Bremer and Frank Sturgis stayed at the Lord Elgin Hotel, in Ottawa. They stayed in the same section of the Hotel. Frank Sturgis was the control officer of Arthur Bremer on the road. It was he who was passing on money and information to Bremer.
Sturgis and Bremer stayed in the same section of the Lord Elgin Hotel that the Secret Service detail of Richard Nixon was staying in.
SKOLNICK: Could Bremer, at one point, have targeted Nixon for assassination?
CIBA: You will recall that the same mythology was created in the assassination of John Kennedy: that Oswald was after Nixon and then, because security was so tight, he instead trained the crosshairs of his weapon on Jack Kennedy. The same thing here: they want you to believe that Bremer was after Nixon and because security was so tight, again, the "lone assassin" trained his gun on someone else -- Wallace.
It was all part of a false trail. You know, you always lay a trail of "golden apples."
SKOLNICK: So how long have you been on this case?
CIBA: On this particular case, I've been on it for close to four years. But I've been involved in assassination research for 27 years.
I was able to interview, on this particular junket, not only Governor Wallace; I was able to interview John Ehrlichmann, Colonel Fletcher Prouty... I also spoke to John Judge, president of the Coalition On Political Assassinations.
SKOLNICK: Continue telling us, Ciba: Why do you believe that there was a plot?
CIBA: In Milwaukee, Arthur Bremer's control officer was not Frank Sturgis. It was a man by the name of Dennis Salvatore Cosini Guzman(sp?). Dennis Guzman was a journalism student at Marquette University, in Milwaukee. While Bremer was in Milwaukee, he attended a series of meetings of the SDS: the Students for a Democratic Society.
SKOLNICK: There were agents provocateurs in the Students for a Democratic Society.
CIBA: And Cosini was one of them.
I'll tell you who else was involved: Donald Segretti.
SKOLNICK: Really!?
CIBA: He was seen in Milwaukee in the presence of Arthur Bremer and J. Timothy Gratt(sp?), who was the head of the Young Republicans.
"I THINK THAT IT IS E. HOWARD HUNT WHO PLANTED
'BREMER'S DIARY' INSIDE OF BREMER'S PARKED CAR."
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SKOLNICK: You're saying that known figures were involved in the attempted assassination of George Wallace during the '72 Presidential campaign. You mentioned Frank Sturgis. Are you ready to contend that E. Howard Hunt, who was involved that same year in the Watergate break-in, that he was in some way involved? He went to Bremer's apartment, after the Wallace shooting.
CIBA: He denies it. But not only do I think he went to the apartment in Milwaukee, I think that it is E. Howard Hunt who planted "Bremer's diary" inside of Bremer's parked car, in Maryland. That's what I think.
SKOLNICK: All right: you've got Sturgis. You've got Hunt. You've got Segretti... Now Segretti was?
CIBA: He was chieftain of the "dirty tricks" department for Richard Nixon, at the street level.
SKOLNICK: In other words, to break up peace parades...
CIBA: ...the planting of Nazi memorabilia on Wallace's cars, and things of that nature.
SKOLNICK: To target Wallace?
CIBA: Oh yes. As a Nazi. In order to dissuade people from voting for him.
"THE ERA OF THE COMMON MAN HAS LONG BEEN OVERDUE."
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SKOLNICK: I followed some of the Wallace campaign in '68 and '72. Wallace wanted to tax the Rockefeller Foundation; he wanted to tax the very rich. He said things that appealed to common people, of all kinds of parties.
One of the things which I've been told by retired government intelligence officials that I've known over the years is, that when a person makes statements that give the impression that the era of the common man has arrived, if it gains momentum, it causes the ultra rich to say, "That guy... Forget about the ballot. The bullet!"
CIBA: The era of the common man has long been overdue. So whenever you get anyone who takes that stand...
SKOLNICK: Like Abraham Lincoln. [Like Martin Luther King.]
CIBA: Yes. Because the truth has always made authority tremble.
SKOLNICK: Did Wallace fit that mold? Did he start a psychology that the era of the common man had arrived?
CIBA: Yes. Without a doubt. His whole campaign was geared toward the blue-collar.
Bear in mind that many, many was the time that the Governor of Alabama said, "They are having meetings about me in them there banks up in the Northeast."
It is known that the Rockefellers were very worried about the candidacy of Governor Wallace because it threatened the re-election of their man, Richard Nixon.
SKOLNICK: What are some of the "nuts and bolts" that lead you to believe there was a conspiracy against Wallace?
CIBA: It has been, for over two decades, believed that the Milwaukee CIA control officer of Arthur Bremer, Dennis Salvatore Cosini Guzman, died on July the 6th, 1972, in Toronto, Canada. He was supposed to have been given a "hot shot" of heroin.
Dennis Salvatore Cosini Guzman is not dead. He is alive. I know this for a fact. I know where he's living. I know the alias that he's using. I know the industry that he works in. And if there was, in fact, a body found at the Toronto airport, it was not Dennis Guzman.
SKOLNICK: Is Bremer in jail for the rest of his life?
CIBA: Yes. He got 67 years. He will never get out alive.
SKOLNICK: He doesn't say anything in the jail?
CIBA: He refuses to speak to anyone about anything. They keep him segregated.
He's another mystery. When he was arrested, the people standing next to the shooter couldn't identify Arthur Bremer as being the shooter. Arthur Bremer's fingerprints are not on the weapon. The weapon could not be matched to the bullets taken from the Governor.
SKOLNICK: Was there a government investigation?
CIBA: No.
They gave Arthur Bremer a parrafin test. They found no gunpowder residue on his hands.
SKOLNICK: One indication of a covert operative is that he's very active in things, with no visible income. He lives well. Was that true of Bremer?
"NIXON PASSED IT ON TO BEBE REBOZO. BEBE HAD A BANK.
UPON REACHING THE BAHAMAS, THE MONEY WAS SHIFTED
INTO SWITZERLAND, INTO A BANK RUN BY ROBERT VESCO."
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CIBA: Yes, and he travels well. We know that part of the money was being garnered from Robert Vesco's organization in Toronto...
SKOLNICK: Vesco!? He's involved in it too?
CIBA: In the trafficking of narcotics into Canada. Here's how the Vesco money was being utilized, in part. Money was being sent from Toronto by Vesco's organization into the Maryland political organization, the Republican organization. Part of that money was taken out. The rest was sent over to the office of Congressman William O. Mills. Congressman Mills would take his cut, and pass the rest on to Vice President Spiro Agnew. (Remember that Maryland was Agnew's fiefdom. He ran it like a camp.) Agnew would take his cut and pass the rest on to Richard Nixon. Richard Nixon would then take part of that money that was left and put a smile on the pocket of Attorney General John Mitchell. And it was John Mitchell who was directly responsible for keeping Robert Vesco out of the hands of U.S. authorities.
SKOLNICK: They're trying lately to bring Vesco back to the United States.
CIBA: They're not going to bring him back to the United States because the people that are in power behind-the-scenes do not want Robert Vesco on U.S. soil. There's too many bones, and he knows where the bones are buried.
SKOLNICK: They'd have to dig up Nixon's skeleton from the cemetery and hang him from a rope.
CIBA: Nixon, after sharing the money with John Mitchell, took the remainder and passed it on to Bebe Rebozo, his Cuban lifelong friend in Miami. Bebe had a bank. And it was through Bebe's bank that the money was funneled out into the Bahamas. Upon reaching the Bahamas, the money was put into a bank, taken out immediately, and shifted over into Switzerland into a bank that was -- no surprise -- run by Robert Vesco.
Part of that money that Robert Vesco shipped down south into Maryland, to Nixon... $25,000 was taken out of that, out of the coffers of Congressman Mills, and sent north into Milwaukee. It was placed into the hands of Milwaukee multi-millionaire attorney Herbert A. Spenner(sp?). Spenner was the head of the German bund in Milwaukee in 1972. And he was seen drinking beer on many an occasion with Arthur Bremer.
SKOLNICK: Are you saying that Nixon was part of it all? Or that there was an apparatus that helped Nixon, whether Nixon knew or not?
CIBA: Nixon was part of it. Nixon knew. And Nixon was a witting conspirator.
SKOLNICK: Do you think Wallace knows the nature of the conspiracy that almost killed him?
"J. EDGAR HOOVER HAD TO BE REMOVED BEFORE THEY MOVED
UPON WALLACE, BECAUSE HOOVER WAS AN ENEMY OF THOSE
THAT HAD ENCIRCLED RICHARD NIXON."
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CIBA: Sure. He knows.
And let me just say before we're through: it wasn't just Wallace who knew. You couldn't just move upon Wallace while J. Edgar Hoover was alive. Because J. Edgar Hoover was threatening the Nixon White House.
SKOLNICK: Whoa.... Wait a minute. You bring up an interesting point. Hoover died very mysteriously.
CIBA: He died May the 1st, 1972, two weeks before Wallace was moved upon.
SKOLNICK: A story about Hoover's death appeared in the Harvard University Crimson. Two people who claimed they were tied in with Frank Sturgis claimed that they were the ones who put exotic poison into Hoover's dental items or toiletries?
CIBA: What they did was the following: Hoover had to be removed before they moved upon Wallace, because Hoover was an enemy of those that had encircled Richard Nixon -- what was known as the German Mafia. Hoover hated them with a purple passion, he wanted them removed, and he had told Nixon that he must get rid of them.
SKOLNICK: On May 1st, J. Edgar Hoover was probably murdered. There was no autopsy. The laws provided for an autopsy, but there wasn't any. And they took him away to the mortuary. And then two people showed up who supposedly poisoned Hoover.
May 1st: Hoover probably murdered. Attempted murder in the middle of May against George Wallace. Then, several weeks after that, the Watergate break-in.
CIBA: Nixon spoke to Hoover and told him, "I want you to resign." Hoover told the President, "I am not going to resign." So then, the "Plumbers" went into Hoover's house, and they doused his toiletries with a genre of Thio-phosphates(sp?). This is a poison that is based on limestone and brimstone and sulphur that eats up the oxygen in your circulatory system.
SKOLNICK: We have a few minutes left, Ciba. Tell us: What do you want the public to understand?
CIBA: History, despite its wrenching pain, cannot be unlived. But if we rise up to meet it head-on, then history need not be re-lived. When we as a people fail, or worse yet, refuse to stand up to the injustice of our historical past, then that injustice becomes an ever-present constant in our daily lives.
SKOLNICK: Is political assassination part of the fabric of America?
CIBA: It is part of the tapestry, and it is a very vital weave indeed.
SKOLNICK: In other words, when they say, "Oh, that was long ago..."
CIBA: You're still living it now!!
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